Thanks Frank for another enlightening reply. I gleaned 3 main points: 1. The govt can’t legislate morality, 2. You can lead a horse to water, but…, etc., 3. Marx mark on economics doesn’t fly.
Eureka! Jesus was right again: “Love thy neighbor as yourself” to attain Ultimate Truth.
Does Zen satori require the same thing that Christianity does to achieve Nirvana?
Again, thanks for verifying Christianity via Western philosophy to this humble sinner.
I attempted to explain your Trinity, Dualism, AI to my friend and got this “Say What?” look so I forwarded your text.
To wit: “Like “faith” you cannot mandate a recognition or acceptance of Absolute Truth until someone is ready to accept it.” - Frank Elkins
P.S. for everyone on earth to achieve Christlike perfection, i.e.., Truth, heaven on an earth, is a tall order. I don’t foresee this happening in the near future. Perhaps AI can give us a boost.
Abstract ideas and concepts articulately theorized, Frank. (a 60s hippy might say “Heavy stuff, man, but like, it’s cool). I was introduced to German philosopher Georg Hegel in my senior year of high school when Mr Millikan explained how Karl Marx conceived his economic theory in “The Communist Manifesto.” Marx utilized Hegel’s duality of thesis and antithesis to be factored into synthesis. Hegel proposed capitalists (thesis) vs. workers (antithesis) to be synthesized to “form a more perfect union” (where’d we hear that phrase?!) as Communism. This ideology looks like a perfect solution to the inequality status of capitalists vs workers… at least it does on paper. The issue Marx and his comrade, Friedrich Engels, failed to fully understand was human nature and economics.
Real quick!! Hegel’s philosophy developed into two opposing camps; one being “Marxism.” However, I think they missed a critical point in Hegel’s philosophy. Hegel argued that “Absolute Truth” would develop in human consciousness “naturally over time,” IT CANNOT BE FORCED OR COERCED. Human beings must come to it individually one-at-a-time until the “collective consciousness” and the “individual consciousness” are essentially the same.
In Christian terms, and Hegel was massively influenced by Christianity, you cannot force someone to “accept the Holy Spirit.” However, if each individual in the world all did voluntarily choose to accept the “Absolute Truth,” described in the trinity as the Holy Spirit, THEN the Kingdom of Heaven could be established on earth; but not until them. Until then human beings continue to rely on empirical law and rational morality, until as a collective race we naturally come to this understanding on our own. It is a process; a process of “becoming.”
Thus, there will likely come a time when “all” human beings realize the connection between individual and group human consciousness in terms of “loving your neighbor as yourself.” However, any attempt to force or coerce this outcome will only make things worse. Hegel argued that you must allow these things to naturally evolve on their own. The “perfect state” is when all the citizens agree on their morality; not where citizens are forced to enact the state’s morality. So, basically, morality does not reside in the state, the state should reflect where individual citizens are on their journey toward Absolute Truth. Like “faith” you cannot mandate a recognition or acceptance of Absolute Truth until someone is ready to accept it.
There are also a lot of other related moral issues involved when human beings attempt to “force” a specific morality; crucifixion, inquisitions, and Holy wars are example of “forced” morality. This is one of the major reason Marxism has never worked and never will. It is essentially a government in which the state dictates morality, not just through empirical law, but by using empirical law to coerce rational thought. This all directly ties into “Enlightenment” philosophy which focuses heavily on “individual rights, individual sovereignty, and individual autonomy.” From their perspective, this is what ultimately leads us closer to perfection, or Absolute Truth.
From a Western perspective the path to Absolute Truth is manifested through the individual, which leads to a higher state of “Giest,” or overall human consciousness. It begins with the individual and moves toward a “citizen based” form of government. Marxism involves a “state directed” form of government in which the individual is not important or critical to the overall goal of the state. This is not really a Hegelian concept; from Hegel’s perspective there can be laws for limiting disruptive behavior, but there cannot be “forced morality.” Forced, or coerced, morality cannot lead to Absolute Truth; it only makes the journey slower and more difficult.
Check out my three-part Special Edition Substacks about Hegel, a very complex philosopher! Not as quick as I thought, but it’s Hegel!!
Thanks Frank for another enlightening reply. I gleaned 3 main points: 1. The govt can’t legislate morality, 2. You can lead a horse to water, but…, etc., 3. Marx mark on economics doesn’t fly.
Eureka! Jesus was right again: “Love thy neighbor as yourself” to attain Ultimate Truth.
Does Zen satori require the same thing that Christianity does to achieve Nirvana?
Again, thanks for verifying Christianity via Western philosophy to this humble sinner.
I attempted to explain your Trinity, Dualism, AI to my friend and got this “Say What?” look so I forwarded your text.
To wit: “Like “faith” you cannot mandate a recognition or acceptance of Absolute Truth until someone is ready to accept it.” - Frank Elkins
P.S. for everyone on earth to achieve Christlike perfection, i.e.., Truth, heaven on an earth, is a tall order. I don’t foresee this happening in the near future. Perhaps AI can give us a boost.
Abstract ideas and concepts articulately theorized, Frank. (a 60s hippy might say “Heavy stuff, man, but like, it’s cool). I was introduced to German philosopher Georg Hegel in my senior year of high school when Mr Millikan explained how Karl Marx conceived his economic theory in “The Communist Manifesto.” Marx utilized Hegel’s duality of thesis and antithesis to be factored into synthesis. Hegel proposed capitalists (thesis) vs. workers (antithesis) to be synthesized to “form a more perfect union” (where’d we hear that phrase?!) as Communism. This ideology looks like a perfect solution to the inequality status of capitalists vs workers… at least it does on paper. The issue Marx and his comrade, Friedrich Engels, failed to fully understand was human nature and economics.
Hi Julia!
Real quick!! Hegel’s philosophy developed into two opposing camps; one being “Marxism.” However, I think they missed a critical point in Hegel’s philosophy. Hegel argued that “Absolute Truth” would develop in human consciousness “naturally over time,” IT CANNOT BE FORCED OR COERCED. Human beings must come to it individually one-at-a-time until the “collective consciousness” and the “individual consciousness” are essentially the same.
In Christian terms, and Hegel was massively influenced by Christianity, you cannot force someone to “accept the Holy Spirit.” However, if each individual in the world all did voluntarily choose to accept the “Absolute Truth,” described in the trinity as the Holy Spirit, THEN the Kingdom of Heaven could be established on earth; but not until them. Until then human beings continue to rely on empirical law and rational morality, until as a collective race we naturally come to this understanding on our own. It is a process; a process of “becoming.”
Thus, there will likely come a time when “all” human beings realize the connection between individual and group human consciousness in terms of “loving your neighbor as yourself.” However, any attempt to force or coerce this outcome will only make things worse. Hegel argued that you must allow these things to naturally evolve on their own. The “perfect state” is when all the citizens agree on their morality; not where citizens are forced to enact the state’s morality. So, basically, morality does not reside in the state, the state should reflect where individual citizens are on their journey toward Absolute Truth. Like “faith” you cannot mandate a recognition or acceptance of Absolute Truth until someone is ready to accept it.
There are also a lot of other related moral issues involved when human beings attempt to “force” a specific morality; crucifixion, inquisitions, and Holy wars are example of “forced” morality. This is one of the major reason Marxism has never worked and never will. It is essentially a government in which the state dictates morality, not just through empirical law, but by using empirical law to coerce rational thought. This all directly ties into “Enlightenment” philosophy which focuses heavily on “individual rights, individual sovereignty, and individual autonomy.” From their perspective, this is what ultimately leads us closer to perfection, or Absolute Truth.
From a Western perspective the path to Absolute Truth is manifested through the individual, which leads to a higher state of “Giest,” or overall human consciousness. It begins with the individual and moves toward a “citizen based” form of government. Marxism involves a “state directed” form of government in which the individual is not important or critical to the overall goal of the state. This is not really a Hegelian concept; from Hegel’s perspective there can be laws for limiting disruptive behavior, but there cannot be “forced morality.” Forced, or coerced, morality cannot lead to Absolute Truth; it only makes the journey slower and more difficult.
Check out my three-part Special Edition Substacks about Hegel, a very complex philosopher! Not as quick as I thought, but it’s Hegel!!
https://frankelkins.substack.com/p/special-edition-hegels-philosophy
https://frankelkins.substack.com/p/special-edition-hegels-philosophy-23c
https://frankelkins.substack.com/p/special-edition-hegels-philosophy-7e6
Take care…